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Topic: I break the

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AZKC

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Posted: July 04 2004,1:09 pm

Post # 1

weirdest sh!t :break

#3 intake pushrod rocker end broke :stupid

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AZKC

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Posted: July 04 2004,1:17 pm

Post # 2

Oh but wait theres more :guns

found both pushrods bent on #7. So now I best ck the rest of them :stupid

I'm kinda stuck on what the hell is causing this. The pistons are flat tops, the valve adjustment is on the loose side of the scale, can the push rods just bend under a load :confused

without having somekind of interference issues. These bent at around 3000-3500 rpm :drama

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AZKC

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Posted: July 04 2004,2:17 pm

Post # 3

Well I also found #5 had a bent one also, the other bank 2,4,6,and 8 seem fine. But I did pull the #7 plug out and its pretty hammered the tip is gone and the electrode is mangeled, guess its time to yank the head and see whats going on in there :stupid

To hot right now maybe in October :drink

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Posted: July 04 2004,5:43 pm

Post # 4

I hate to mention this KC, but it looks like the timing chain jumped. :eek

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Posted: July 04 2004,8:19 pm

Post # 5

Kevin, you have a binding problem somewhere, pushrods don't bend(or break) like that from load...You need to measure things up!. :beat

And you do that before you hit Hooters so you can read the fkn numbers!.

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AZKC

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Posted: July 05 2004,9:21 am

Post # 6

I'm gona yank the head today and take a looksy inside #7 cylinder I think I'll find some valve damage :banghead

Pretty doubtful on the timing chain dealio there Roberto it only has about 10-15 hours on it. I am going to re-ck the cam dial in and verify TDC is TDC :cool

The bent push rods I think were after the fact. The broken tip on the #3 hole now that one has me a little worried :stupid

Stay tuned :drama

Edited by AZKC on July 05 2004,9:22 am

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Posted: July 05 2004,10:31 am

Post # 7

Quote (AZKC @ July 05 2004,9:21 am)

I'm gona yank the head today and take a looksy inside #7 cylinder I think I'll find some valve damage :banghead

Pretty doubtful on the timing chain dealio there Roberto it only has about 10-15 hours on it. I am going to re-ck the cam dial in and verify TDC is TDC :cool

The bent push rods I think were after the fact. The broken tip on the #3 hole now that one has me a little worried :stupid

Stay tuned :drama

Yeah, on second though, I believe you're right KC. The timing chain wouldn't cause the spark plug electrode to get hammered. :beat

Dropping a valve will.

I did have a crank break once that did cause pushrod and rocker damage like that on a 335 Cummins diesel. That was an expensive rebuild. :cry

Edited by Bullitt Bob on July 05 2004,10:33 am

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AZKC

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Posted: July 05 2004,7:37 pm

Post # 8

Moving along

I got the distributor out today :rotflmao

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Posted: July 05 2004,7:40 pm

Post # 9

Quote (AZKC @ July 05 2004,9:21 am)

I'm gona yank the head today and take a looksy inside #7 cylinder I think I'll find some valve damage :banghead

Pretty doubtful on the timing chain dealio there Roberto it only has about 10-15 hours on it. I am going to re-ck the cam dial in and verify TDC is TDC :cool

The bent push rods I think were after the fact. The broken tip on the #3 hole now that one has me a little worried :stupid

Stay tuned :drama

Well I guess it's my fault for not keeping track here, :banghead

but I thought the last set of heads you got, you had Larry go over them and put a "GOOD" set of valves in!.. :stupid

Now you did check for piston to valve clearance right???, and you did check for coil bind right???, and you did check for retainer to guide clearance right???...Don't get me wrong, I'm not trying to be a smartass here, just making sure all the bases were covered. Pushrods don't bend or break unless something is binding!..

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Posted: July 05 2004,9:02 pm

Post # 10

ouch! how did that happen?

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Posted: July 05 2004,9:37 pm

Post # 11

That's what I'm trying to figure out!. :stupid

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AZKC

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Posted: July 06 2004,8:08 am

Post # 12

The machine shop cked them over and said they were in good shape. I used the valves that came with the heads. Didn't ck piston to valve clearance and did not check for retainer interference. Are the 781 heads that different from the 049's.

This is the same valve train and pistons that I ran last summer when I took out the crankshaft I had about 10-15 hours on it. Thats why I'm questioning all the clearance re-cks, I guess the guy could have shaved the heads 20 or 30 and that would create some issues. I'll do some cks while I have the head off to verify things are not banging into stuff.

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Posted: July 06 2004,9:04 am

Post # 13

bet that sounded pretty - when it let go - that would be a big ohhh shhhhiriirirrririttittt ------ are you running a cloyes - three key way timming chain ? :puke

adios pussy cat

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AZKC

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Posted: July 06 2004,5:33 pm

Post # 14

Yeah it sounded kinda like a last breath from a dying animal. Sad but its becoming a familiar sound :beat

I run a 3 key crank sprocket but its from Comp Cams not Cloyes probably the same stuff though. I heard that Comp grinds 4 degrees into the cam I use so I leave it in the stock 0* position.

The whole mystery behind all this is it worked just fine in the previous motor that I wiped out the #1 and 2 rod bearings after about 10-15 hours. Then it was in the next motor that ate #8 intake valve in about 2-3 hours now this :stupid

which happened in about an hour. The heads were used and deemed usable but I'l bet I've got another broken valve

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AZKC

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Posted: July 06 2004,7:13 pm

Post # 15

Well I came home and popped the intake off and peeked in the intake port of #7 and the valve guide is missing a chunk so that valve is bent for sure :cry

Which I pretty much knew allready :beat

I'll get the head off tomorrow and see if the head is salvageable.

Something I picked up on today which need more verification is the Comp Cam 940-16 springs are said to be good up to .500 lift, they sold them to me for a cam that has .570 */-
lift.

And a question why don't all of the cylinders have the same problem?

When I set the valves I 0 lash them then 1/2 turn which I have heard is a little loose on roller tip rockers. Should I retard my cam 4* next time. I'm going to get Comp on the phone tomorrow morning and pick their brain abit :phone

Ah the wonderful world of DYI, next I think I'll try building a house :rotflmao

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Posted: July 06 2004,7:39 pm

Post # 16

Quote (AZKC @ July 06 2004,8:08 am)

The machine shop cked them over and said they were in good shape. I used the valves that came with the heads. Didn't ck piston to valve clearance and did not check for retainer interference. Are the 781 heads that different from the 049's.

This is the same valve train and pistons that I ran last summer when I took out the crankshaft I had about 10-15 hours on it. Thats why I'm questioning all the clearance re-cks, I guess the guy could have shaved the heads 20 or 30 and that would create some issues. Ã‚Â I'll do some cks while I have the head off to verify things are not banging into stuff.

From the factory all those heads were the same. But now just about anything you find has been rebuilt at at one time or another, some more than once and who knows by who!. Depending on what kind of shop did them, who knows how they installed the guides. I've seen some that came from "Fleet Rebuilders" without the guides cut down and the retainers would just about touch with the factory cam..And then who knows what valves were used, those $3.95 valves are marginal for daily driver use, but yet they still can be in good shape when you look at them!..Any more if I buy used stock heads, as far as I'm concerened I'm buying castings, the rest gets shit canned and I start off new. That way I know what I have. When I take heads in all I get done is what I can't do at home (valve job, sufaced, guides put in), If I had the machines I would do it all..I cut the guides down for the seals I use and stack everything up myself and measure everything up for clearance that way there's no dought!..

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Posted: July 06 2004,7:50 pm

Post # 17

Quote (AZKC @ July 06 2004,5:33 pm)

Yeah it sounded kinda like a last breath from a dying animal. Sad but its becoming a familiar sound :beat

which happened in about an hour. The heads were used and deemed usable but I'l bet I've got another broken valve

Cams are usually all ground 4 degrees to account for chain stretch but that don't mean they are no matter what brand. I just finished a motor for a friend of mine and when I degreed the cam, I had to add a 2 degree button to bring it straight up, but he's using a gear drive so he don't have to worry about the chain crap. I've also had to retard a cam to bring it to specs!..That is why "YOU NEVER PUT A CAM IN WITHOUT DEGREEING IT"!.. BTW, a little info here, Cloyes used to be top of the line, but they are not Cloyes anymore, that shit is JUNK!.. :angry

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Posted: July 06 2004,8:00 pm

Post # 18

Quote (AZKC @ July 06 2004,7:13 pm)

When I set the valves I 0 lash them then 1/2 turn which I have heard is a little loose on roller tip rockers. Should I retard my cam 4* next time.

Ok I admit it, I'm a fkn dumb ass! :banghead

Please explain what you mean by 1/2 turn lash??? :stupid

I use feeler guages, not turns!. :stupid

I don't think I'd go more than .030 lash myself!....Why retard the cam 4*??? degree it to the cam ticket!. :rolleyes

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AZKC

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Posted: July 06 2004,8:01 pm

Post # 19

I here ya preachin brother :good

I've been trying to shoestring this project on a very limited budget and its bit me one to many times I'm thinking. May just dry dock the boat till times get better. For the money to build a motor right you can buy another boat that runs :beer

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Posted: July 06 2004,8:19 pm

Post # 20

Quote (AZKC @ July 06 2004,7:13 pm)

Something I picked up on today which need more verification is the Comp Cam 940-16 springs are said to be good up to .500 lift, they sold them to me for a cam that has .570 */-
lift.

Ok, before you panic check the cam ticket for your spring specs, then check the springs for the closed and open specs at the specified heights, if they meet the specs than it's good to go, who cares what they say it's supposed to be...Even when you buy a matched kit, you "ALWAYS" measure and check things out, just because it's supposed to be the right stuff, that don't mean it is!..AND that goes for ANY cam manufacturer, they are all the same, and if you read the fine print, they all tell you the same thing, if you don't check and verify stuff, once you run it and there's a problem, oh well tough shit, you should have checked it!.. :eek

A long time ago I used to use Isky springs(they don't make them, there's only a couple of outfits that make them for everybody) because I lived right down the road from them. I would go in there and check them out right there, sometimes I'd go thru 30 springs before I'd get a set that was right!.. :rolleyes

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Posted: July 06 2004,8:24 pm

Post # 21

Quote (AZKC @ July 06 2004,8:01 pm)

I here ya preachin brother :good

Dude, I did the same shit a long time ago. I learned that taking shortcuts to save a buck ended up costing me 10 times as much, not to mention the aggravation!.. :banghead

No more of that shit!.. :rolleyes

Edited by GoFastRacer on July 06 2004,8:26 pm

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Posted: July 06 2004,8:31 pm

Post # 22

Quote (AZKC @ July 06 2004,8:01 pm)

For the money to build a motor right you can buy another boat that runs :beer

Nope, I got a 475 under the bench that would be a perfect match for your boat!..

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Posted: July 06 2004,10:44 pm

Post # 23

Damn, all this exciting discussion is making me thirsty. :drink

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AZKC

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Posted: July 07 2004,7:18 am

Post # 24

Quote (GoFastRacer @ July 06 2004,8:00 pm)

Quote (AZKC @ July 06 2004,7:13 pm)

When I set the valves I 0 lash them then 1/2 turn which I have heard is a little loose on roller tip rockers. Should I retard my cam 4* next time.

Ok I admit it, I'm a fkn dumb ass! :banghead

Ã‚Â

Please explain what you mean by 1/2 turn lash??? :stupid

I use feeler guages, not turns!. :stupid

I don't think I'd go more than .030 lash myself!....Why retard the cam 4*??? degree it to the cam ticket!. Ã‚Â :rolleyes

Well I've never heard of using feeler gauges on a hydraulic cam either so I guess we're even :rotflmao

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GoFastRacer Male

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Posted: July 07 2004,7:25 am

Post # 25

Quote (AZKC @ July 07 2004,7:18 am)

Quote (GoFastRacer @ July 06 2004,8:00 pm)

Quote (AZKC @ July 06 2004,7:13 pm)

When I set the valves I 0 lash them then 1/2 turn which I have heard is a little loose on roller tip rockers. Should I retard my cam 4* next time.

Ok I admit it, I'm a fkn dumb ass! :banghead

Ã‚Â

Please explain what you mean by 1/2 turn lash??? :stupid

I use feeler guages, not turns!. :stupid

I don't think I'd go more than .030 lash myself!....Why retard the cam 4*??? degree it to the cam ticket!. Ã‚Â :rolleyes

Well I've never heard of using feeler gauges on a hydraulic cam either so I guess we're even :rotflmao

Didn't know you had a hydraulic cam!. So what you mean is a 1/2 turn "PRELOAD" on the lifter!..

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41 replies since July 04 2004,1:09 pm

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