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Post Icon Posted: July 13 2004,10:03 pm Post # 1 see this member send this member a private message  quote this post in reply
Well, pulled the motor down after I got back from Pheonix... my boating is over this year.  

I found the other push rod... or at least part of it.


A steam cleaned cylinder... if you look close, you can see where the exhaust valve is hitting the piston.


Here's the offending cylinder head.  You can't really tell, but the seat's are screwed up, and the neighboring hole is not in good shape either.  Looks like I've got a cracked head.  


Ok, here's the money shot.  A bent pushrod and what I can find of the other one.


Moral of the story people, check your piston to valve clearance.   :angry

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Post Icon Posted: July 13 2004,11:16 pm Post # 2 see this member send this member a private message  quote this post in reply
First KC and now you? :eek

Sorry to see you're having troubles. :(

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Post Icon Posted: July 14 2004,5:46 am Post # 3 see this member send this member a private message  quote this post in reply
Sorry to hear that, bummer!. :( I dought that it's a clearance problem, you'd have a few more. I'd lay odds that it was valve float, hydraulic cam with week springs or lifter pump up. Somebody may have have gotten nuts and zinged the motor!.. :rolleyes Do you actually see a crack in the head?? :stupid
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Post Icon Posted: July 14 2004,7:15 am Post # 4 see this member send this member a private message  quote this post in reply
Bummer,same type of thing happend to a friend of mine a last year and I pretty much narrowed it down to weak springs and or over reving of his 455..Good luck with the new motor

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Post Icon Posted: July 14 2004,7:29 am Post # 5 see this member send this member a private message  quote this post in reply
After looking the motor over, it doesn't appear to have much time on it.  You can see little outlines of valves on all the pistons, #5 is just the worst offender.  

#5 hole is scored/gouged, it'll have to be punched out to clean it up.  Wether or not I have to do any machining on the crank has yet to be seen.  I'm going to pull the main caps tonight and see what's there.  So I'll at least need a set of .060 over pistons and rings.  

As for the head, the seats are gone on #5, I'll have to do a little more digging around to see if the heads cracked, that's just a guess.

Edited by Sleek-Jet on July 14 2004,7:30 am

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Post Icon Posted: July 14 2004,8:22 am Post # 6 see this member send this member a private message  quote this post in reply
Must be some virus running amuck down here "Bendapushroditis"  :laugh

Where's the other part of the push rod :stupid  It'll be interesting to see the specs on the cam.  :cool

Oh I see some of the mangled parts laying on the head, is that most of it :eek

Edited by AZKC on July 14 2004,8:23 am

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Post Icon Posted: July 14 2004,8:38 am Post # 7 see this member send this member a private message  quote this post in reply
Quote (AZKC @ July 14 2004,8:22 am)
Oh I see some of the mangled parts laying on the head, is that most of it :eek

All that I can find so far.  :D

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Post Icon Posted: July 14 2004,8:04 pm Post # 8 see this member send this member a private message  quote this post in reply
Quote (Sleek-Jet @ July 14 2004,7:29 am)
After looking the motor over, it doesn't appear to have much time on it.  You can see little outlines of valves on all the pistons, #5 is just the worst offender.  

#5 hole is scored/gouged, it'll have to be punched out to clean it up.  Wether or not I have to do any machining on the crank has yet to be seen.  I'm going to pull the main caps tonight and see what's there.  So I'll at least need a set of .060 over pistons and rings.  

As for the head, the seats are gone on #5, I'll have to do a little more digging around to see if the heads cracked, that's just a guess.

Still think it's valve float, if it was a bad clearance problem you would have a bunch of broken pushrods, just happen that one cylinder got hit the hardest!..

BTW, I just took another look at those pushrods, those have the balls welded on the ends, those are junk I've seen those come off under normal running conditions!.. :(

Edited by GoFastRacer on July 14 2004,8:07 pm
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Post Icon Posted: July 14 2004,9:35 pm Post # 9 see this member send this member a private message  quote this post in reply
Yeah, they are the welded on ones.  No worries, I'm getting the one piece pushrods when it goes back togather.

I pulled the main caps off tonight, and some of the rod caps, the bearing looks almost new, so I think I dodged a bullet there.  New bearings are on order as well.

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Post Icon Posted: July 15 2004,5:46 am Post # 10 see this member send this member a private message  quote this post in reply
Quote (Sleek-Jet @ July 14 2004,9:35 pm)
Yeah, they are the welded on ones.  No worries, I'm getting the one piece pushrods when it goes back togather.

I pulled the main caps off tonight, and some of the rod caps, the bearing looks almost new, so I think I dodged a bullet there.  New bearings are on order as well.

When you pull the crank out, take a look and see if the top and bottoms of the bearings are worn equally. FE's were notorious for not having straight main saddles from the factory..Usually a line hone is standard prosedure on a rebuild, but yours may have been done already since it has been rebuilt before, I'm sure more than once too!.. :laugh
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Post Icon Posted: July 25 2004,6:52 am Post # 11 see this member send this member a private message  quote this post in reply
Just a little update here.  I got the engine torn down and cleaned up the last part of the week.  On Thursday I took the block to Larry's to get sonic-checked, should have it back sometime this week.  The crank is in excellent shape as far as I can tell.  It's 10/10 right now, and doesn't need anything other than a little polishing on journals (though I haven't mic-ed it yet).  The rods have been machined for floating pins as well, and all are in good shape except 2.  The heads will need to be rebuilt, just for peace of mind if nothing else.

I'm still kicking around what to do.  I'd like to have a tranny in the boat, since this is supposed to be more of a fun play around boat than a lake racer, reverse would be nice.   :rolleyes  And while FE's are pretty good engines, I'm not really a big Ford fan, I'd like to have a Chevy as I've got at least some spare parts for them laying around.   My frame of mind at this moment is to peddle the 390, build a Chevy w/tranny and re-rig the boat this winter... we'll see.

All of this is just an exersize in "what if" right now, since a complete engine rebuild is out of the budget picture.

Edited by Sleek-Jet on July 25 2004,6:54 am

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Post Icon Posted: July 25 2004,7:31 am Post # 12 see this member send this member a private message  quote this post in reply
Heck since it's just a going to be a play thing, you'd be better off just freshening up that motor and go have fun, put that motor together right and it will outlast the time that you'll have that boat, BTW, all FE rods have floating pins from the factory!. :) . You're looking at good chunk of change to switch over and if you put a tranny in it you will have to turn the motor around and refab everything..Also trannys are not too cool in a flat, they take up all the room and it messes up the weight distribution and you don't dare go into reverse with them either!.. :D
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Post Icon Posted: July 25 2004,12:50 pm Post # 13 see this member send this member a private message  quote this post in reply
Well, the engine is kinda past the freshening up stage.  

It'll need to be bored and take new pistons, the #5 hole is deeply scored from ingesting part of the valve seat.  Ã‚ 

2 of the connecting rods need re-worked, and I'll probably put new rod bolts in, so the big ends will need resized as well.  

The engine will need balanced.

The cam sat to long and is pitted from rust.

All new push rods.

The heads will at a minimum need to be disassebled and looked over real well.  At least 2 cylinders need all new valves and seats.

Probably put new valve springs in, to match whatever cam I get.

And of course all the bearings and variouse assundry pieces that go with an overhaul.

The only thing I think I can get away with right now (and I still haven't checked it out yet either) is the crank.

So I'm looking at a complete rebuild of the FE.  As soon as I find out about the block being OK or not, I'll start comparing real numbers.

Edited by Sleek-Jet on July 25 2004,12:54 pm

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Post Icon Posted: July 25 2004,1:21 pm Post # 14 see this member send this member a private message  quote this post in reply
Well I guess in that case we'll have to call it a total rebuild!.. :D  :laugh Oh btw, take the rocker shafts apart and see what they look like!.. :eek  :D
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Post Icon Posted: July 25 2004,1:33 pm Post # 15 see this member send this member a private message  quote this post in reply
Quote (GoFastRacer @ July 25 2004,1:21 pm)
Oh btw, take the rocker shafts apart and see what they look like!.. :eek  :D

Oh yeah, I forgot.  :stupid

I need to take all the rocker arms off and clean them up, look all that over as well.

At least the manifold isn't cracked (I don't think it is at least.  :rolleyes ).  :D

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Post Icon Posted: July 25 2004,3:21 pm Post # 16 see this member send this member a private message  quote this post in reply
Yep, check the bottom of the shaft that's where the wear will be if any!..Also if the motor had any kind of crud build up, pop the press plugs on the end of the shafts to clean them, if they get plugged with crud the rockers won't get any oil!.. :)
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Post Icon Posted: July 29 2004,8:29 pm Post # 17 see this member send this member a private message  quote this post in reply
Sooo, did you get the block back yet, is it worth rebuilding, how about the rocker arm shafts??.. :D
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Post Icon Posted: July 29 2004,9:09 pm Post # 18 see this member send this member a private message  quote this post in reply
Quote (GoFastRacer @ July 29 2004,8:29 pm)
Sooo, did you get the block back yet, is it worth rebuilding, how about the rocker arm shafts??.. :D

Went and picked up the 390 from Larry today.  All's good witht the block.  I've got a line on not one, but two 427's FE's for sale.  :D  If I can get a decent deal on one of them, I'm gonna try to rebuild one of those.  I'll peddle the 390 parts.

I pulled the casting #'s off the heads and they come out to 68 Galaxie heads (C8AE).  Not knowing anything about Fords, I don't know if those are decent heads or not??   :stupid

Rebuilding is still a couple months off.  I gotta 427 chevy on the engine stand I'm starting on tomorrow :D (finally).  I need to get it done before I do the boat engine.   :good

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Post Icon Posted: July 29 2004,9:46 pm Post # 19 see this member send this member a private message  quote this post in reply
Very cool :good But are you sure they are 427's?? :stupid (C8AE) stands for a lot of things, what are the rest of the numbers?...Back then you could buy a car with what ever you wanted in it. 68 was the last year for the 427 and it was a hydraulic cam motor and it had low riser heads but the odds are that it wouldn't be in a Galaxie, I'll lay odds it's a 428, but it is possible that it's a 427!..Look at the block just above the oil pan, if it's a 427 it will have 3 bolts in the side of the block for the 3 center mains and also it would be a side oiler so look for a hump along the side with 1/4 pipe plugs in it!..After 30 some years it's not likely to be the original stuff, just be careful what you're looking at!.. :rolleyes
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Post Icon Posted: July 30 2004,1:56 pm Post # 20 see this member send this member a private message  quote this post in reply
Sorry, that's what I get for posting under the influence...  :rolleyes

The head #s I gave are off the 390 I've got, not the 427's.
C8AE-H was the complete #.  What other #'s should I be looking for??

The 427's are one of those "I gotta friend that knows a guy" type deals.  They might not even exist.  But there is always a possibility.  :D

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Post Icon Posted: July 30 2004,9:26 pm Post # 21 see this member send this member a private message  quote this post in reply
Here's a chart I dug up of head part numbers hope it helps!..BTW, if those are GENUINE 427's and the guy knows what he's got, be prepared to dish out the $$$$$$$$$!... :D

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Post Icon Posted: July 30 2004,9:42 pm Post # 22 see this member send this member a private message  quote this post in reply
Here's what a 427 side oiler block looks like, this is the only way to tell what block they are!.. :)

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Post Icon Posted: July 30 2004,9:57 pm Post # 23 see this member send this member a private message  quote this post in reply
If it were me, I'd just build the 390 block with forged internals and slap on a set of 406 or 427 heads, but since those are rare as hell, a good set of 428CJs will really let that dude breathe with minor valve work. :)

The 390 is no slouch when it's assembled correctly and would be probably the most reliable for several seasons of trouble free fun for the money. :good

As much as I'm a Ford nut, I think they suck in a boat. You can build a likewise Chevy for 1/2 the money as much as I hate to admit it. :stupid

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Post Icon Posted: July 31 2004,6:16 am Post # 24 see this member send this member a private message  quote this post in reply
The 390's bore is too small for 427 heads, the valves hit the block, the CJ's will work though!...My first boat had a 390 in it when I bought it and it ran over 70 and it was a mild motor, nothing wrong with them in a boat!..But yes, the cost is outrageous compared to a Chevy, and the fact that it's getting harder and harder fo find the good stuff for them!. That's why when Ford discotinued the FE, I went to Chevy!. :rolleyes
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Post Icon Posted: July 31 2004,8:49 am Post # 25 see this member send this member a private message  quote this post in reply
Quote (GoFastRacer @ July 31 2004,6:16 am)
The 390's bore is too small for 427 heads, the valves hit the block, the CJ's will work though!...My first boat had a 390 in it when I bought it and it ran over 70 and it was a mild motor, nothing wrong with them in a boat!..But yes, the cost is outrageous compared to a Chevy, and the fact that it's getting harder and harder fo find the good stuff for them!. That's why when Ford discotinued the FE, I went to Chevy!. :rolleyes

Oops, you're right Art. I was thinking standard 428 and typed in 427. :banghead

The Ford BB engine parts are getting so hard to find because restoring '64-'73 Mustangs is huge stuff these days. Some guys are even using truck 390s because they can't find GT390s. Try to find a Boss 429 cammer. It's just like before Chrysler started offering up the 426 Hemi again. If you can find one, plan on spending $15,000 for a short block up to $25,000 for a complete engine. :stupid

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