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Topic: Question for the Master, need some more advice Art< Next Oldest | Next Newest >
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Post Icon Posted: April 25 2006,3:04 pm Post # 1 see this member send this member a private message  quote this post in reply
Art, can you give me some ideas for increasing gas mileage on my boat. I installed an HEI over the winter with new wires and plugs. I did not install a performance module in it but I did check total advance and it is 32 deg at 2500. I re jetted the carb but I can lean it out a little more, plugs are still a little black. What I would like is to be able to run around all day on one tank and fill it up in the evening with gas that I bring with me so I dont have to pay the steep price at the marina. I ordered a 14.25 21 pitch prop, I have a 14.25 19 pitch on it now, I tried a 17 pitch and I cant even get the boat to plane without overpowering it so I think the 21 wont be too much. Will the better bite of the 21 pitch help with part throttle crusing fuel mileage because that's where I pull the kids at? :stupid

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Post Icon Posted: April 25 2006,8:33 pm Post # 2 see this member send this member a private message  quote this post in reply
How many RPM'S are you turning At WOT??  :stupid  If you are running it up against the rev limiter easily, then the larger pitch may work for you, but if you can't then the larger pitch may just kill your bottom end and give you less mph on the top end, thus killing your mpg.

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Post Icon Posted: April 25 2006,10:29 pm Post # 3 see this member send this member a private message  quote this post in reply
W.W. - I had a 1996 Reinell Rampage w/350 c.i. and an alpha drive and found that I had to run a 19 pitch. I would get about 5.5-6hrs   of skiiing out of about than 14 gals of gas. This was 3 guys on a day trip that was done several times a summer to Saguaro. Hope it helps.
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Post Icon Posted: April 26 2006,6:54 am Post # 4 see this member send this member a private message  quote this post in reply
If your HEI is bone stock, an aftermarket coil and module and a good set of insulated solid core wires is a must. Your total is low, you should have 22 degrees in the distributer and 36 total all in by 2500-2800(do you have vacuum advance??)even 38 if your compression can take it, it will start very easy and run smoothe!. This will make a difference in your plug reading, no matter how much you lean it out, without a good ignition and proper timing you'll never burn the gas efficiently and the plugs will always show black!... As far as the prop goes CE is right, you should be just about running out of motor at the limiter, if you can't reach it the prop is too big and vice versa. But at the same time if you're close a different pitch may not help, efficiency is the key and and that can make a huge difference in mileage, not to mention a lot nicer to drive, that's where the prop guys come in, stock props are stock props all they do is move the boat. When I built my ski boat to pull the kids, I had my prop worked on 3 times before I got it right, and I went from using almost 20gals a day to less than 20gals for the whole weekend, and that was with a big block!... Something to think about!..

Edited by GoFastRacer on April 26 2006,6:55 am
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Post Icon Posted: April 26 2006,7:43 am Post # 5 see this member send this member a private message  quote this post in reply
Quote (Carrera Elite @ April 25 2006,8:33 pm)
How many RPM'S are you turning At WOT??  :stupid  If you are running it up against the rev limiter easily, then the larger pitch may work for you, but if you can't then the larger pitch may just kill your bottom end and give you less mph on the top end, thus killing your mpg.

I can get 5300RPM with the stock HEI, the old points only got me 4900 at best. I can reach top speed and RPM easily (quickly) with the HEI.

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Post Icon Posted: April 26 2006,7:50 am Post # 6 see this member send this member a private message  quote this post in reply
Quote (GoFastRacer @ April 26 2006,6:54 am)
If your HEI is bone stock, an aftermarket coil and module and a good set of insulated solid core wires is a must. Your total is low, you should have 22 degrees in the distributer and 36 total all in by 2500-2800(do you have vacuum advance??)even 38 if your compression can take it, it will start very easy and run smoothe!. This will make a difference in your plug reading, no matter how much you lean it out, without a good ignition and proper timing you'll never burn the gas efficiently and the plugs will always show black!... As far as the prop goes CE is right, you should be just about running out of motor at the limiter, if you can't reach it the prop is too big and vice versa. But at the same time if you're close a different pitch may not help, efficiency is the key and and that can make a huge difference in mileage, not to mention a lot nicer to drive, that's where the prop guys come in, stock props are stock props all they do is move the boat. When I built my ski boat to pull the kids, I had my prop worked on 3 times before I got it right, and I went from using almost 20gals a day to less than 20gals for the whole weekend, and that was with a big block!... Something to think about!..

I need to make some time to get down to Don's Hot Rod to get a coil and module. I was worried about putting too much advance in the dist before I tested it out on the water. I'm going to bump the initial timing up to 12 from 10 and get some different advance weights and springs to get me to 38 total. I don’t have an adjustable vacuum advance should I get that also?

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Post Icon Posted: April 26 2006,11:33 am Post # 7 see this member send this member a private message  quote this post in reply
Since I'm absorbing all this wealth of knowledge through all of you, it has got me thinking.  
On a 496ho with 26 pitch prop running 4800 rpm at wot what can I do to maximize it?  :stupid   Should I go with a bigger prop and a better wires or.........
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Post Icon Posted: April 26 2006,11:36 am Post # 8 see this member send this member a private message  quote this post in reply
I've seen the modules and coils at AutoZone and Checker on Ina if you want something closer.

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Post Icon Posted: April 26 2006,1:41 pm Post # 9 see this member send this member a private message  quote this post in reply
Quote (LASINC @ April 26 2006,11:33 am)
Since I'm absorbing all this wealth of knowledge through all of you, it has got me thinking.  
On a 496ho with 26 pitch prop running 4800 rpm at wot what can I do to maximize it?  :stupid   Should I go with a bigger prop and a better wires or.........

I'd say Leave it alone......

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Post Icon Posted: April 26 2006,2:49 pm Post # 10 see this member send this member a private message  quote this post in reply
Quote (AZKC @ April 26 2006,11:36 am)
I've seen the modules and coils at AutoZone and Checker on Ina if you want something closer.

Fringe benefit at Don's because I work with a race team. If work would stop getting in my way I would have more time to go to the lake and the track :banghead

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Post Icon Posted: April 26 2006,6:23 pm Post # 11 see this member send this member a private message  quote this post in reply
Quote (LASINC @ April 26 2006,11:33 am)
Since I'm absorbing all this wealth of knowledge through all of you, it has got me thinking.  
On a 496ho with 26 pitch prop running 4800 rpm at wot what can I do to maximize it?  :stupid   Should I go with a bigger prop and a better wires or.........

I don't now about the 496 s but the small blocks were rev limited at  about 4800rpm. Check the owners manual. Sounds like yours is pretty well hooked up. :good

Edited by Tuchop on April 26 2006,6:25 pm
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Post Icon Posted: April 27 2006,5:45 am Post # 12 see this member send this member a private message  quote this post in reply
Quote (weldwade @ April 26 2006,7:50 am)
I need to make some time to get down to Don's Hot Rod to get a coil and module. I was worried about putting too much advance in the dist before I tested it out on the water. I'm going to bump the initial timing up to 12 from 10 and get some different advance weights and springs to get me to 38 total. I don’t have an adjustable vacuum advance should I get that also?

When you put the curve kit in make sure you put the little bushing in to give you more initial, at 38 you should have 16 initial!.. If you don't have vacuum advance don't worry about it, I've tried it and it didn't make any difference!..
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Post Icon Posted: April 27 2006,6:02 am Post # 13 see this member send this member a private message  quote this post in reply
Quote (LASINC @ April 26 2006,11:33 am)
Since I'm absorbing all this wealth of knowledge through all of you, it has got me thinking.  
On a 496ho with 26 pitch prop running 4800 rpm at wot what can I do to maximize it?  :stupid   Should I go with a bigger prop and a better wires or.........

You can always benefit from an ignition upgrade!. If you have a rev limiter check to see what it's set at, if it's at 4800 and the boat seem to work ok a bigger prop may just pull the motor down, usually they come with the right combination but you can probably increase it's efficiency and not change the way the motor runs!..
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Post Icon Posted: April 27 2006,7:08 am Post # 14 see this member send this member a private message  quote this post in reply
Art, if there is a rev limiter on my engine I don’t know where it is or if it even works if it is there. I was surprised to see the RPM over 5K this trip. My experience with rev limiters is with chips on MSD and Crane ignitions so I’m uneducated about marine setups. The other thing I noticed is the water temp only ran 130-140 all weekend. I replaced the belts hoses and thermostat over the winter. Last year it would run 160.

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Post Icon Posted: April 27 2006,7:33 am Post # 15 see this member send this member a private message  quote this post in reply
Factory limiters are smoothe you don't even notice them, it just seems like you reached maximum rpm!.. Your thermostat may be sticking open or it's not what it says it is, I always check a new one before put it in, be surprised at how many are not accurate!.. But I wouldn't worry about it as long as the oil is up to temp, that's the important part!..

Edited by GoFastRacer on April 27 2006,7:34 am
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Post Icon Posted: April 27 2006,7:42 am Post # 16 see this member send this member a private message  quote this post in reply
Quote (GoFastRacer @ April 27 2006,7:33 am)
Factory limiters are smoothe you don't even notice them, it just seems like you reached maximum rpm!.. Your thermostat may be sticking open or it's not what it says it is, I always check a new one before put it in, be surprised at how many are not accurate!.. But I wouldn't worry about it as long as the oil is up to temp, that's the important part!..

Looks like I need to buy an oil temp gauge. I usually check thermostats before I install them but I focked up this time, too many irons in the fire.

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Post Icon Posted: April 27 2006,8:28 am Post # 17 see this member send this member a private message  quote this post in reply
Quote (weldwade @ April 27 2006,7:42 am)
Quote (GoFastRacer @ April 27 2006,7:33 am)
Factory limiters are smoothe you don't even notice them, it just seems like you reached maximum rpm!.. Your thermostat may be sticking open or it's not what it says it is, I always check a new one before put it in, be surprised at how many are not accurate!.. But I wouldn't worry about it as long as the oil is up to temp, that's the important part!..

Looks like I need to buy an oil temp gauge. I usually check thermostats before I install them but I focked up this time, too many irons in the fire.

Ain't that the way it goes, first time you don't check it you get a bad one!.. :D  :laugh
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Post Icon Posted: April 27 2006,8:38 am Post # 18 see this member send this member a private message  quote this post in reply
Art, where is the rev limiter? 4.3 OMC. I’m guessing it’s electronic to the coil somehow? I'm curious.

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Post Icon Posted: April 27 2006,11:51 am Post # 19 see this member send this member a private message  quote this post in reply
Quote (weldwade @ April 25 2006,3:04 pm)
Art, can you give me some ideas for increasing gas mileage on my boat. I installed an HEI over the winter with new wires and plugs. I did not install a performance module in it but I did check total advance and it is 32 deg at 2500. I re jetted the carb but I can lean it out a little more, plugs are still a little black. What I would like is to be able to run around all day on one tank and fill it up in the evening with gas that I bring with me so I dont have to pay the steep price at the marina. I ordered a 14.25 21 pitch prop, I have a 14.25 19 pitch on it now, I tried a 17 pitch and I cant even get the boat to plane without overpowering it so I think the 21 wont be too much. Will the better bite of the 21 pitch help with part throttle crusing fuel mileage because that's where I pull the kids at? :stupid

WW, for what it's worth...I emailed a buddy who has the same boat, bit newer, he is running a 14 1/4, 21 and says that he used his GPS data to figure out he was getting 3 MPG on average.

I don't know if that works for you or not, but I wish I got that. :D

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Post Icon Posted: April 27 2006,1:34 pm Post # 20 see this member send this member a private message  quote this post in reply
Thanks Glass Man, I just want to be able to run around for the weekend without having to go to the marina for gas. I brought 15 gal with me this past trip and only used 10 of it so I think I can do a 3 day trip now without getting slapped at the marina pump, that's after I follow Art's advice :good

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Post Icon Posted: April 27 2006,2:08 pm Post # 21 see this member send this member a private message  quote this post in reply
Quote (weldwade @ April 27 2006,8:38 am)
Art, where is the rev limiter? 4.3 OMC. I’m guessing it’s electronic to the coil somehow? I'm curious.

A buddy of mine had a 1980s something Baja (I think) w/ an OMC and it did not have a rev limiter (he could blow it up if tried).
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Post Icon Posted: April 27 2006,3:04 pm Post # 22 see this member send this member a private message  quote this post in reply
Quote (weldwade @ April 27 2006,1:34 pm)
Thanks Glass Man, I just want to be able to run around for the weekend without having to go to the marina for gas. I brought 15 gal with me this past trip and only used 10 of it so I think I can do a 3 day trip now without getting slapped at the marina pump, that's after I follow Art's advice :good

I know exactly what you are feelin' bro......I had to put a splash in the tank at Topock a couple of weeks ago. I got 16 gallons for $60. :eek

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Post Icon Posted: April 27 2006,7:17 pm Post # 23 see this member send this member a private message  quote this post in reply
Quote (LASINC @ April 26 2006,11:33 am)
Since I'm absorbing all this wealth of knowledge through all of you, it has got me thinking.  
On a 496ho with 26 pitch prop running 4800 rpm at wot what can I do to maximize it?  :stupid   Should I go with a bigger prop and a better wires or.........

It sounds like it may have too much prop.  The rev. limiter is 5200 on an HO and you can only pull 4800  rule of thumb is roughly 300 rpm per 1 deg.

Now the second I say that someone will correct me :stupid  but rough. so maybe have yours tweeked to a 25.

I went the other way had a 24 4 blade and went to a 25, Hitting the rev limiter.

just a thought :good

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Post Icon Posted: April 27 2006,9:18 pm Post # 24 see this member send this member a private message  quote this post in reply
Quote (weldwade @ April 27 2006,8:38 am)
Art, where is the rev limiter? 4.3 OMC. I’m guessing it’s electronic to the coil somehow? I'm curious.

If you have one it will be linked to the distributer somewhere, with an HEI it has to be close to it!.. Easy way to tell is give it a quick rev, if it goes beyond 5500-6000 you don't have one!..
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Post Icon Posted: April 27 2006,9:41 pm Post # 25 see this member send this member a private message  quote this post in reply
Quote (stingray @ April 27 2006,7:17 pm)
Now the second I say that someone will correct me :stupid  but rough. so maybe have yours tweeked to a 25.

Well it took more than a second!. :laugh But like I said when you're close(which he is)reworking the prop can be more beneficial, even if you change to one that will let you pull the rpm's that don't mean that it is "efficient", that's the difference between a $200 prop versus an $800 prop!.. As an example, last year I had mine reworked because I was blowing the prop away coming out of a turn and that sucked big time, so I had a slight cup put on it, now it flat out hooks up and goes and at the same time it gave some tail lift and freed up the boat and I got 11 more mile an hour out of it and only a 100 more rpm, it's all about "efficiency"!.. Best $100 I spent in a long time!.. :good  :laugh
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