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shueman

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Posted: Nov. 08 2005,5:45 am

Post # 1

Board hears Clark County wastewater plan
TSN staff reports

KINGMAN, Ariz. - The Clean Water Coalition (CWC) plan to pump treated wastewater deep into Lake Mead is stirring concern down river. CWC Program Administrator Doug Karafa detailed the proposal during Monday's Mohave County Board of Supervisors meeting.
Bullhead City resident Martin Koppell urged supervisors to formally oppose the $650-million project. He said southern Nevada officials are simply trying to pass the wastewater down the lower Colorado River system, potentially harming the drinking water supply and tourism in Arizona and California.
Koppell said the proposal is a corrective action given that southern Nevada made the mistake of placing its drinking water intake system 'down-flow' from where the wastewater currently flows into the lake from the Las Vegas wash. "They are just moving their pollution problem so it will become our problem ...polluting our drinking and recreation water," Koppell said.
Karafa said continued growth in southern Nevada could see 300 million gallons of effluent being pumped into the lake each day by 2030. He said the water will nearly meet drinking standards at the point of discharge and will mix and safely disperse with current.
The Board of Supervisors scheduled a November 21 public hearing before Mohave County takes a position on the plan in advance of a December 7 deadline for providing input for an Environmental Impact Statement. Representatives of various Arizona agencies and entities and governmental bodies along the Colorado River will be invited to attend the hearing and provide their own input.

Great, huh.... :confused

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shueman

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Posted: Nov. 08 2005,5:51 am

Post # 2

Another article....

Hearing set on water releases

By Molly Coulter - Lake Havasu Herald
Monday, November 7, 2005 10:23 PM MST

The Board of Supervisors will hold a public hearing later this month to discuss the Clean Water Coalition's proposed plan to release millions of gallons of effluent into Lake Mead.

Doug Karafa, program administrator for the Clean Water Coalition, attended the board's first regular meeting inside the county's new administration building in Kingman Monday morning to present the coalition's plan and motives behind it.

Currently Las Vegas releases the city's treated wastewater into Lake Mead upstream from city water supplies via the Las Vegas Wash. Karafa said this method has caused rapid erosion in the wash and wide growth of algae blossoms in the lake. Karafa said while the lake could sustain the treated wastewater levels of the 1960s and 1970s, the area's exploding population required an alternative method for releasing the effluent.

Following the coalition's proposed plan, the treated wastewater would flow into the center of Lake Mead via a seven-mile pipe, downstream from the area's water supplies.

Audience member Martin Koppel of Bullhead City said the plan would release far more effluent into the Colorado River instead of circulating it into Las Vegas' drinking water supplies, effectively dumping the city's growth problems onto users downstream.

â€œThey (Las Vegas) have the money to responsibly and realistically solve their problem,â€ Koppel said. â€œWe do not have the money to deal with this problem. If they are forced to keep the water clean for them, they'll keep it clean for us.â€

Board Chairman Tom Sockwell said many people who use Lake Havasu and the Colorado River for recreation were concerned with the plan and its effects downstream.

Eleanor Koppel, a former president of a water district board in California, said the plan would shovel Las Vegas' pollution problems down river.

â€œThe Colorado River will be overwhelmed by pollution,â€ Koppel said. â€œThere will be far less tourists' dollars if the river is polluted.â€

Karafa said the plan would continue to treat effluent in Lake Mead at high national standards and the coalition would continually improve its methods.

â€œIf we protect Lake Mead, certainly we'll protect areas downstream,â€ Karafa said.

The coalition used a citizens advisory group of about 27 members to formulate the plan, but only one person attended from Arizona representing Phoenix, not the entire state or the lower Colorado River valley.

Supervisor Buster Johnson, who is openly opposed to the proposed plan, asked the board to make an official statement on the issue.

Supervisor Pete Byers said he needed more scientific research before he made a decision either way. The board agreed to invite representatives from various boards to a public hearing to be held before Dec. 7, which is the end of the coalition's public comment period for its draft environmental impact statement.

:stupid

To view the Draft Environmental Impact Statement of the proposed plan online, go to www.nps.gov/lame and www.cleanwatercoalition.com. The coalition will accept comments via e-mail at eis@cleanwatercoalition.com until Dec. 7. The public can submit written comments to â€œSCOP EIS Project Manager, PBS&J, 2270 Corporate Circle, Suite 100, Henderson, NV 89074-6382.

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Posted: Nov. 08 2005,6:59 am

Post # 3

Â seems whether they do it or not the shit still gets dumped in the lake,and near drinking levels aint near enough

Edited by rivercookdave on Nov. 08 2005,7:00 am

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stingray

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Posted: Nov. 08 2005,9:59 am

Post # 4

shit rolls down hill so its headed to us. :ass

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Posted: Nov. 08 2005,9:10 pm

Post # 5

Think about that next time you're swimming in the river down :puke

stream......

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stingray

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Posted: Nov. 08 2005,10:41 pm

Post # 6

I think about it when I stand up river and pee and look down river at everyone else. but they are doing it with 300 million gallons. :puke

Â I can't do that on a good weekend.

and near drinking water quality is scary.

Edited by stingray on Nov. 08 2005,10:50 pm

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mspencer55 Male

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Posted: Nov. 09 2005,12:28 am

Post # 7

We don't swim in their toilets...and they sure as hell can't pee in our river!

This is very upsetting. How can these a**holes even give any thought to dumping more into the river? That's right...more !!! They are already using the river as their personal septic tank, this has to stop !!! Contemplating the notion of dumping even more is beyond comprehension.

Do you suppose the pro-dump people would mind if we stopped at their place (instead of the Chevron station) and pissed on their lawn, or into their pool?

Treated water my ass !!! How many times have we seen on the news that a water treatment plant somewhere, had a malfunction, and only dumped 37 bazzllion gallons of raw sewage into some ocean, stream or lake that our kids swim in, that we catch fish in (some people eat the fish), that we use to irrigate millions of acres of farmland, and by the way, there's a hell of a lot of people that drink it.

Now, I'm not the kind of guy to get up on a soap box, but I think it's time for every person who reads this to contact anyone who could help. Assemblymen, congressmen, senators, mayors, pastors, ect. If eough people talk to enough people, just think of the confusion we could create.

Here's an idea! New senate bill proposing nuclear testing AND dumping sites at Tropicana & Las Vegas Blvd. I'm sure this would relieve the problems of Sin City.

Enough said, thanks for listening.
I feel better now.

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Posted: Nov. 09 2005,5:58 am

Post # 8

So what are they supposed to do with it??? Â :stupid

Oh, and just so we have an idea of how much waste water we are talking about. Â 300 million gallons is about 920 acre feet of water... Lake Mead has a capacity of about 28 million acre feet. Â

And how many people take a port-a-poty to the river, and use it?? I mean if you want to get upset at the amount of treated water pumped into a lake, how about the raw waste that get's deposited on a big weekend. Â And let's not even talk about the junk that comes out of bildge pumps.

Edited by Sleek-Jet on Nov. 09 2005,7:00 am

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shueman

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Posted: Nov. 09 2005,6:30 pm

Post # 9

The river has an amazing way of healing itself.... :cool

There's probably more PPM pollution in Thompson Bay on an average summer week-end....Havasu is getting disgusting... :puke

Funny though, they want to discharge "down lake" from their intake..... :rolleyes

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stingray

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Posted: Nov. 09 2005,10:28 pm

Post # 10

Quote (Sleek-Jet @ Nov. 09 2005,5:58 am)

So what are they supposed to do with it??? Â :stupid

300 million gallons of effluent being pumped into the lake each day by 2030. equals 109,500 million gallons a year that's a hell of a lot more than my bilge and me and all my friends drinking and peeing. treat it and flood the desert with it let soak into the water table and let vegas drink it.

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Posted: Nov. 09 2005,11:43 pm

Post # 11

What are thet supposed to do with it, you ask. Maybe they could re-inject it back into the ground in their own neighborhood, 30 miles away from the river. You know, their reluctance to deal with their "treated" water locally makes you wonder what they're not telling us ormore importantly what they're afraid of.
And about those big weekends of boaters and campers and other waste dumpers. I liken these polluters to a few mere grains of sand in all of the Sahara. Comparing recreational users to the entire city of Las Vegas (and Vegas' waste also increases on those same big weekends) is absolutely absurd, not to mention that Las Vegas is growing at an alarming rate when you consider the amount of additional waste to be generated in the future.
Las Vegas, and the state of Nevada for that matter, certainly have the financial resourses to find or develop a more intelligent solution to this problem. I see they've projected the amount of waste all the way out to 2030, 25 years from now. What about 2050, or 2075, how much then?

Why do I think I'm arguing with the same people who leave their trash behind on the beautiful beaches ?

OK people ! It's time to your heads out of your...the sand and figure out a solution that effects no one other than the producers.

One last thought... I've been visiting the Colorado River since 1958, when the water was cold and clear. The family purchased property on the river in 1970, the water was warmer and brown, you couldn't see the bottom in 10 feet of water. Today, after many years of diligent anti-pollution campaigns and much other hard work by countless numbers of people, the water is again a crisp cold temp and, in my opinion, is cleaner and clearer than I have ever seen it. We have the opportunity to prove that cycles do NOT have to repeat themselves and we can continue to improve the quality not only of the water, but of the lives of all those near and dear to the Colorado River.
Thank you for your time. :fight

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shueman

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Posted: Nov. 10 2005,6:41 am

Post # 12

THANK YOU for your passion and insights... :cool

Well said...

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Posted: Nov. 10 2005,8:03 am

Post # 13

Quote (mspencer55 @ Nov. 09 2005,11:43 pm)

What are thet supposed to do with it, you ask. Maybe they could re-inject it back into the ground in their own neighborhood, 30 miles away from the river. You know, their reluctance to deal with their "treated" water locally makes you wonder what they're not telling us ormore importantly Â what they're afraid of.
And about those big weekends of boaters and campers and other waste dumpers. I liken these polluters to a few mere grains of sand in all of the Sahara. Comparing recreational users to the entire city of Las Vegas (and Vegas' waste also increases on those same big weekends) is absolutely absurd, not to mention that Las Vegas is growing at an alarming rate when you consider the amount of additional waste to be generated in the future. Â Â
Las Vegas, and the state of Nevada for that matter, certainly have the financial resourses to find or develop a more intelligent solution to this problem. I see they've projected the amount of waste all the way out to 2030, 25 years from now. What about 2050, or 2075, how much then?

Why do I think I'm arguing with the same people who leave their trash behind on the beautiful beaches ? Â

OK people ! It's time to your heads out of your...the sand and figure out a solution that effects no one other than the producers.

One last thought... I've been visiting the Colorado River since 1958, when the water was cold and clear. The family purchased property on the river in 1970, the water was warmer and brown, you couldn't see the bottom in 10 feet of water. Today, after many years of diligent anti-pollution campaigns and much other hard work by countless numbers of people, the water is again a crisp cold temp and, in my opinion, is cleaner and clearer than I have ever seen it. We have the opportunity to prove that cycles do NOT have to repeat themselves and we can continue to improve the quality not only of the water, but of the lives of all those near and dear to the Colorado River.
Thank you for your time. Â Â Â Â Â :fight

At least you have an intelligent alternative approach. I will respectfully disagree.

Just as a question, does anyone know what Bullhead, Needles, Lake Havasu City, Parker, and Blythe do with their waste water effluent???

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Posted: Nov. 25 2005,12:27 am

Post # 14

OK, since this finally made it on Drama boat, I'm bumping it up here too...

If anyone wants to learn more than the newpapers are telling you, check out these two sites:

Southern Nevada Water Authority. Â Chapter 3 deals with reuse.
http://www.snwa.com/html/wr_resource_plan.html

Clean Water Coalition. Â The draft EIS can be found here, a little light reading.

http://www.cleanwatercoalition.com

Edited by Sleek-Jet on Nov. 25 2005,1:03 am

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mspencer55 Male

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Posted: Nov. 26 2005,6:45 pm

Post # 15

I own property near Katherine's Landing which has a Bullhead City postal address and code requires a septic tank system.
Laughlin has a water reclaimation system where ALL treated water is reused within the city limits, NO water is dumped into the river.
Give some thought to the large number of golf courses in Vegas. Add to that the irrigation requirements of all of the casinos, schools, parks ect. Are these being watered with "treated" reclaimed water? My guess is no.
This brings to mind the phrase "Pack out what you pack in" meant for hikers & campers to remove every last piece of trash they brought with them in order to maintain a clean & beautiful for all of those who follow. If this "maintenance" did not occur, we would be renaming the campsites to Dumpsites.
In my opinion, allowing ANY dumping of ANY substance into the Colorado River would be irresponsible & just stupid ! Let me remind everyone again that these "Reclaimation Facilities" are designed, built, operated & maintained by human beings. The same humans will design, build, operate & maintain the facilty Vegas is proposing. Maybe they should hire the engineers of the Sepulveda Sewage Treatment Plant which dumped a tremendous amount of raw sewage directly into L.A. Harbor in the 1970's, (they said it could NEVER happen) or, better yet, I hear there are a few NASA space shuttle engineers
and contractors looking for jobs. They are still telling the families of 2 shuttle crews that "it wasn't supposed to happen".
Let's get real, there's no room for argument here.
Find an alternative. :grouphug

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stingray

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Posted: Nov. 27 2005,9:22 pm

Post # 16

I wasn't as eloquent, but I agree. don't put it into the lakes and rivers.

find a long term alternative that has room for growth.

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Ziggy

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Posted: Dec. 05 2005,4:06 pm

Post # 17

Quote (stingray @ Nov. 09 2005,9:28 pm)

Quote (Sleek-Jet @ Nov. 09 2005,5:58 am)

So what are they supposed to do with it??? Â :stupid

I often wondered where Vegas sewage ended up......
Sooner or later we will destroy our earth but if there is a way to lessen the effects for our children and so on we should do something.
Flooding the desert floor and letting it perk was one idea like Sleek said....plenty of uninhabited dry lakebeds around, shit there's a great one right at Stateline. With multiple disposal grounds once one is saturated the flow can be diverted to another and so on in a scheduled circuit til it comes full circle. A reclaimation/recycle plant could lessen the amount even more.....
So many ways around it, just maybe less cost effective in a dollar and cents sense..........but more expensive than the alternative of destruction of our lands.
.
Oh, and on the pack it in-pack it out rant.....more often than not we come back off the lake with twice as much debris than we generated ourselves, do the same in Glamis dunes. Doesn't take much effort plus you are teaching your children some respect and honor.

Edited by Ziggy on Dec. 05 2005,4:11 pm

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shueman

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Posted: Dec. 05 2005,5:39 pm

Post # 18

Quote (Ziggy @ Dec. 05 2005,4:06 pm)

Oh, and on the pack it in-pack it out rant.....more often than not we come back off the lake with twice as much debris than we generated ourselves, do the same in Glamis dunes. Doesn't take much effort plus you are teaching your children some respect and honor.

I'm with you on this.....nothing like pulling up to a nice, sheltered cove and see someone's TRASH LITTER all over the beach.... :puke

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stingray

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Posted: Dec. 05 2005,11:03 pm

Post # 19

The sad part is money holds a higher value than a long term solution. :stupid

And on packing out my trash, my six year old has more respect than some. you don't want to know how tough it is when he digs up old cans & bottles and wants to throw them in the boat. but we do it because it's the right thing to teach. and we all benefit. :good

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shueman

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Posted: Dec. 09 2005,6:17 am

Post # 20

Latest update from TSN:

KINGMAN, AZ - Plans by the Clean Water Coalition (CWC) to build a pipeline that would carry hundreds of millions of gallons of treated wastewater from southern Nevada for direct daily discharge into Lake Mead are drawing protest from downriver entities in Arizona. City Councils in the Colorado River communities of Lake Havasu and Bullhead City signified their opposition during separate Tuesday meetings.
Action by the cities follows the lead of the Mohave County Board of Supervisors which took a similar position November 21.
"I believe that it is reckless for any government to dump effluent into a river or a lake when we have the technology to go ahead and clean that water and make it drinkable," Supervisor Buster Johnson said during the council meeting in Lake Havasu.
CWC officials maintain the proposed practice will be safe given the level of treatment afforded the effluent, combined with mixing action in the lake.
Supervisor Johnson, however, said he's concerned
that some malfunction in the treatment process could pollute the lake and Colorado River with sewage.
The CWC pipeline plan, years from completion,
is proposed as an alternative to the current practice of dumping treated wastewater into the Las Vegas
wash, where some filtering occurs as it runs toward the lake.

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stingray

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Posted: Dec. 09 2005,3:05 pm

Post # 21

didn't someone say something like that. :stupid

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